China cash coin & Netherlands 1981 5 cent silver

Hello all, could do with some help identifying China cash coin and this unusual Netherlands silver 5 cent.

Qianlong, boo-ciowan.
Have you checked all the colonial territories for the Dutch?

Looks like this: https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces4146.html. Maybe it was altered?

Цитата: manxcat12Looks like this: https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces4146.html. Maybe it was altered?

I noticed it's the same design as that one, but can't find any other info about it

It seems like some "forger apprentices" has been practicing on this coin to turn a 1907 year into 1981. If you enlarge the picture, you see some strange metal melting signs and signs of waves around the year. [I think my English is not enough to properly define]

I suspect the Dimitrov workshop in Harmanli, Bulgaria

... they have a "good" track record of doing this with turning a common 5 Korona 1900 or 1908 into an ultra rare 1906 with same method. Check out the mintage: https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces12866.html

Obviously, Mr. Dimitrov would not let the youngsters practice on a 5 Korona coin, as even a 1900 year is about EUR 50, so I bet this is the sandbox  

btw, Mr. Dimitrov and team also does wonderful Roman denarii, a bunch of them is proudly exhibited in this topic: https://en.numista.com/forum/topic16996.html

Imre

Цитата: manxcat12Looks like this: https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces4146.html. Maybe it was altered?

Good guess, riddle-man

Thank you Imre, and also manx. So it was probably 1907 km# PnA 119 originally. Well they have spoilt a good coin.

The Dutch coin is a token, and not silver !

As for the Dutch coin, in the 70's and 80's, a bunch of collector's 'stuivers' were minted. This is one of them. They appear to have been minted by the Royal Dutch Mint. Here's the lot:
http://www.catawiki.com/catalog/tokens-medals/series/1692755-herdenkingsstuivers

They are very delusive coins, which have been featuring on the Numista forum before:
https://en.numista.com/forum/topic10420.html
https://en.numista.com/forum/topic10321.html

And apart from being delusive, they are also very ugly

Some of them are listed in the tokens section, but the one above isn't yet. It would qualify more as a restrike than as a token, I would say.
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces44014.html
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces44177.html
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces15461.html

Thank you for all the info, the coins/tokens/restrikes listed, I think I have most them. I will sort them out and put up some pictures.

Well, then Mr.Dimitrov is exempted from prosecution

However, if you look at the enlarged picture of the date, you can see that the figure 8 is mispositioned, and the last figure 1 is different from the first one. So, it shows, that if the individual coin was not altered, then the mint used some of the original 1907 dies and altered it to 1981 ... and yes, it is not a very high quality engraver work. That is what you call ugly, Arno